Author Topic: T2 pre review  (Read 2859 times)

Offline Ken S

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T2 pre review
« on: September 23, 2017, 03:40:45 am »
Whenever a new Tormek arrives, I seem to have an unusually busy schedule. I try to get spurts of a few minutes in the shop to examine the Tormek. This has worked out to be a good learning situation.

With the T4, I realized how much it resembles the T7. Most of the parts are identical.

With the T2, I was surprised to learn how closely it resembles the T4. The one piece which really separates the two is the machined zinc top. The bottom of the housing is identical, except for the color. This made me curious to see if the water trough from the T4 would work would work with the T2. Quick answer: it does.

The magnet on the knife jig and the post it note strip to prevent scratching the knive from the dry grinding debris: Would they be necessary if the T2 was used as a wet grinder? (Or, to use the brand name term, "used as a Tormek")

I understand Tormek's marketing focus on untrained restaurant personnel. I also agree with Stig that the first choice for someone using a Tormek professionally is the T8. (Not to muddy the waters, however, I also understand Wootz' argument that the T7 is the ideal Tormek model for sharpening knives.)

I am also starting to consider the posdibility that the T2 may be the fastest Tormek for the farmers market sharpener, if used differently than suggested. In fairness, I will first begin by using the T2 exactly "by the book", as if I worked in a restaurant, and with only stardard equipment. I need to work this way until I become fluent with it, imagining no other possibilities.

Then, I will begin by comparing it with the T7/8 and T4 (big T and little T)

Then, the fun part: modifying it with a water trough (and Honerite Gold); a quick release for the honing wheel (spare part from the big T) and a steel EZYlock (also a big T spare part). I want to see what the T2 can do in the hands of an experienced sharpener not wortied about following the manual verbatim. I can even see the possibility that the T2's knife jig might actually proen more efficient than the kenjig if used properly. (How is that for radical thinking?)

Stay tuned.

Ken

ps For the seriously interested, check out the fifteen posts og Magnus Sundqvist. Read the full, very informative topics and look at the linked photos.  Magnus has already been using some of the ideas I thought were different. It is reassuring to know that a knife sharpener of his stature has similar ideas.

Offline cbwx34

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Re: T2 pre review
« Reply #1 on: September 23, 2017, 04:10:14 pm »
Whenever a new Tormek arrives, I seem to have an unusually busy schedule. I try to get spurts of a few minutes in the shop to examine the Tormek. This has worked out to be a good learning situation.

With the T4, I realized how much it resembles the T7. Most of the parts are identical.

With the T2, I was surprised to learn how closely it resembles the T4. The one piece which really separates the two is the machined zinc top. The bottom of the housing is identical, except for the color. This made me curious to see if the water trough from the T4 would work would work with the T2. Quick answer: it does.

The magnet on the knife jig and the post it note strip to prevent scratching the knive from the dry grinding debris: Would they be necessary if the T2 was used as a wet grinder? (Or, to use the brand name term, "used as a Tormek")

I understand Tormek's marketing focus on untrained restaurant personnel. I also agree with Stig that the first choice for someone using a Tormek professionally is the T8. (Not to muddy the waters, however, I also understand Wootz' argument that the T7 is the ideal Tormek model for sharpening knives.)

I am also starting to consider the posdibility that the T2 may be the fastest Tormek for the farmers market sharpener, if used differently than suggested. In fairness, I will first begin by using the T2 exactly "by the book", as if I worked in a restaurant, and with only stardard equipment. I need to work this way until I become fluent with it, imagining no other possibilities.

Then, I will begin by comparing it with the T7/8 and T4 (big T and little T)

Then, the fun part: modifying it with a water trough (and Honerite Gold); a quick release for the honing wheel (spare part from the big T) and a steel EZYlock (also a big T spare part). I want to see what the T2 can do in the hands of an experienced sharpener not wortied about following the manual verbatim. I can even see the possibility that the T2's knife jig might actually proen more efficient than the kenjig if used properly. (How is that for radical thinking?)

Stay tuned.

Ken

ps For the seriously interested, check out the fifteen posts og Magnus Sundqvist. Read the full, very informative topics and look at the linked photos.  Magnus has already been using some of the ideas I thought were different. It is reassuring to know that a knife sharpener of his stature has similar ideas.

I'll give you my experience and/or predictions... you can either confirm or refute them.   ;)

Some protection of the blade from scratching will be needed whether it's run wet or dry.  The magnet will also collect debris... maybe reduced slightly.  I'm not sure running it wet will even keep the stone that much cleaner.  I've been keeping it clean by just holding a damp paper towel to the wheel, after every knife or two, for a couple of rotations.  If you run it wet vs. dry, maybe you can use this as a test to see if there's a difference.

You will not find it "the fastest Tormek" for farmer market sharpening, (unless you alter the desired outcome... and maybe I should add, depending on how you sharpen in the first place... if all a sharpener does is "put an edge" on a knife, then maybe.).  The only speed increase may be using the diamond stone in place of a standard stone... sharpening the same method you currently use.  (In other words... the real benefit for commercial/volume sharpening, may just be the purchase of a diamond stone... but only if the comparison was against a T-4, not a T-7 or T-8).  Like I stated elsewhere... if the volume of sharpening was low, like a store that sharpened the occasional knife for a customer, the T-2 might be a good fit... but not where sharpening is the main job.

Having never used a kenjig, this is a total prediction.. but I don't think you'll find the T-2 jig more efficient... unless the type/design of knives is within a small parameter.

The lack of a USB makes many "outside the box" modifications difficult (certainly different).  Other than freehand, or doing something off the small support, I haven't thought much about sharpening "not following the manual".

That's my gaze into the crystal ball.   :D

I read the posts from Magnus Sundqvist, and in particular, the one where he repaired a broken tip by switching to the diamond stone.  Since I don't repair a tip at the sharpening angle, I don't think I would see the advantage that he did.  (Not saying he's wrong, just a different way).

p.s.  Don't misunderstand any of the above... I still think it's a good sharpener for its intended use.

Offline SharpenADullWitt

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Re: T2 pre review
« Reply #2 on: September 24, 2017, 03:39:01 pm »
Replied to your PM.  There are reasons that these are not designed for wet use.  This has to do with a spot for bacteria growth, and certification (NSF) rather then if it will work well wet or dry.  The diamond wheel is designed for dry use, the same way a steel is designed for dry use, just more aggressive (not just bend/straighten the edge).  My restaurant friends, have three knives that I sent.  They have gone from scary sharp, to being able to easily cut paper.  I do doubt that the T2 can get it scary sharp the way the stone on any of the other machines can.  It certainly should be able to get it/keep it sharp, that will be great for the average person, as well as having clean cuts if they injure themselves, but wouldn't be to the skinning a tomato that those who only use their own knives, use. (in my expectations)

If they were to accept one, I expect I would still be doing some personal knives, but the machine would be for those using the "store knives".
Favorite line, from a post here:
8)

Yeah you know Tormek have reached sharpening nirvana when you get a prosthetic hand as part of the standard package :/)

Offline cbwx34

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Re: T2 pre review
« Reply #3 on: September 24, 2017, 05:10:39 pm »
Replied to your PM.  There are reasons that these are not designed for wet use.  This has to do with a spot for bacteria growth, and certification (NSF) rather then if it will work well wet or dry.  The diamond wheel is designed for dry use, the same way a steel is designed for dry use, just more aggressive (not just bend/straighten the edge).  My restaurant friends, have three knives that I sent.  They have gone from scary sharp, to being able to easily cut paper.  I do doubt that the T2 can get it scary sharp the way the stone on any of the other machines can.  It certainly should be able to get it/keep it sharp, that will be great for the average person, as well as having clean cuts if they injure themselves, but wouldn't be to the skinning a tomato that those who only use their own knives, use. (in my expectations)

If they were to accept one, I expect I would still be doing some personal knives, but the machine would be for those using the "store knives".

Ha... you made me look... PM, what PM?   Guessing it was from Ken.   ;)

Good info though... glad you shared it in the forum.  I agree with your expectations.

p.s. (from your post in other thread)... I ran a couple of serrated knives on the edge of the honing wheel... not much better from this limited test.

Offline Ken S

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Re: T2 pre review
« Reply #4 on: September 24, 2017, 05:38:29 pm »
Very good posts, CB and SADW. Your thoughts are sound.

As I stated, my thoughts here are based on observation, rather than actual sharpening. While experienced based observation is no substitute for actual use, I do believe it can complement a report.

SADW makes a very good point. He is much familiar with restaurant health codes, which I am not. With that in mind, I will limit my review to using the T2 as intended by Tormek, dry.

I admit to being fascinated with tweaking things. The DWK-200 diamond wheel and rubber honing wheel strike me as being very versatile. In fairness, until I know that they are available as spare parts, I will not review them outside of their intended use.

I will begin actual testing.

Ken

ps to CB: If I use the T2 wet, I would remove the magnet from the knife jig and tape it to the water trough, as I did with my original T7 and T4.

Offline cbwx34

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Re: T2 pre review
« Reply #5 on: September 25, 2017, 03:05:26 pm »
I spent the weekend with the T-2... about the only "tweak" I made, was putting black marks on the angle guide, (at the 5 deg. intervals), so I could see them.  ::)

Made one other change though... I'll keep it quiet for now, to see if you arrive at the same conclusion... but one I think expands on its capabilities (but puts it outside of its "intended use").  8)

Offline Ken S

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Re: T2 pre review
« Reply #6 on: September 27, 2017, 03:37:27 am »
SADW AND CB,

Yes, CB, the pm referred to by SADW was sent by me. When I know a member is interested in a particular topic, I often send a pm to make sure the member is aware of a post. I know SADW works with friends in the restaurant business.

CB, at this point you have had more experience with the T 2 than I have. I believe as I have more bench time with the T2 my edges will become sharper. How much sharper I don't know. I normally sharpen knives with the edge trailing direction and lift at the tip. Neither will work with the T2. This not necessarily a limitation, however, it will require me to modify my usual technique.

I like your idea of marking every five degrees. The scale can be difficult for me to see. Your suggestion solves the problem.

SADW, I like your "cake knife" term. I will make a cake knife and then reestablish the bevels to test the efficacy of the 600 grit wheel.

I think it is unfortunate that the handbook is so lean on stone grader recommendations. I believe that approximately 600 grit is a good starting grit for knives with the SG wheels.

Keep thinking and keep posting.

Ken