Author Topic: Guided honing on the leather wheel?  (Read 2089 times)

Offline Cyrano

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Guided honing on the leather wheel?
« on: July 03, 2018, 12:36:02 am »
Is there a method by which one can hone knives on the standard leather honing wheel while maintaining precise control over the honing angle?

I haven't yet found any configuration of jig and USB which will allow me to hold a constant 12-degree angle between a blade and the leather wheel.


Offline cbwx34

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Re: Guided honing on the leather wheel?
« Reply #1 on: July 03, 2018, 12:45:26 am »
Is there a method by which one can hone knives on the standard leather honing wheel while maintaining precise control over the honing angle?

I haven't yet found any configuration of jig and USB which will allow me to hold a constant 12-degree angle between a blade and the leather wheel.

Have you watched wootz's video?

https://youtu.be/UckPmizllk0?t=9m30s

He has the most accurate method I know.  8)

Edit to add:  I had to go try this, to make sure it worked... but you can use any of the calculators to set the USB.  But, you have to use the USB to Stone measurement to set the USB.  Set the Wheel Diameter to match the leather wheel diameter (it's supposed to be 220mm, but double check, I think wootz measures it at 215mm), and use the measured Projection Distance and desired Angle.

Worked for me... give it a try, and let me know what you find.

(But, I think the "Horizontal to Vertical" conversion shown in the video is a better setup).
« Last Edit: July 03, 2018, 01:53:17 am by cbwx34 »

Offline Cyrano

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Re: Guided honing on the leather wheel?
« Reply #2 on: July 03, 2018, 02:00:14 am »

Have you watched wootz's video?

https://youtu.be/UckPmizllk0?t=9m30s

He has the most accurate method I know.  8)


Perfect!!! Thanks so much.

Offline Cyrano

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Re: Guided honing on the leather wheel?
« Reply #3 on: July 03, 2018, 11:43:59 pm »
Here's why I need a guided system for stropping ...


Offline wootz

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Re: Guided honing on the leather wheel?
« Reply #4 on: July 05, 2018, 10:42:46 am »
for comparison, this edge is not rounded by honing:
« Last Edit: July 05, 2018, 10:44:25 am by wootz »

Offline jeffs55

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Re: Guided honing on the leather wheel?
« Reply #5 on: July 05, 2018, 12:47:59 pm »
Am I not understanding the problem. Why would you need a honing guide? You simply avoid "rolling over" the edge. A guide is not required at all, I can do it; so can you. Rolling over is caused by exceeding the sharpening angle. If your sharpening angle is 25 degrees for instance and you hone at 30 degrees, you are rolling over the edge. What did that semi famous writer say and who was it? Oh yeah, Shakespeare said "much ado about nothing". Besides, due to different diameters of the honing wheel and the stone it is just going to be a trial and error attempt to match one to the other. Best answer is to use something like the Kenjig or Herman Trivilinos device, I believe Hermans was the HK something or other.
You can use less of more but you cannot make more of less.

Offline cbwx34

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Re: Guided honing on the leather wheel?
« Reply #6 on: July 05, 2018, 02:45:45 pm »
Am I not understanding the problem. Why would you need a honing guide? You simply avoid "rolling over" the edge. A guide is not required at all, I can do it; so can you. Rolling over is caused by exceeding the sharpening angle. If your sharpening angle is 25 degrees for instance and you hone at 30 degrees, you are rolling over the edge. What did that semi famous writer say and who was it? Oh yeah, Shakespeare said "much ado about nothing". Besides, due to different diameters of the honing wheel and the stone it is just going to be a trial and error attempt to match one to the other. Best answer is to use something like the Kenjig or Herman Trivilinos device, I believe Hermans was the HK something or other.

I think you have to look at it in context... wootz is sharpening at what he calls "presentation standard"... i.e.  sharpening a knife to as high a level as possible.  He describes it in this thread.  He's not alone in the concept of guided honing (nor in the concept of honing/stropping at a lower angle).  He also describes how he does it to account for the difference in wheels (in the videos)... it's not a "trial and error" process.

I follow a few sharpening forums, and there is a trend in this direction... I think it's a good thing that wootz has brought it to the Tormek... as most dismiss it as not being capable of doing this.  Not everyone has a need or desire for it... but nice to know it's possible.

Offline Ken S

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Re: Guided honing on the leather wheel?
« Reply #7 on: July 05, 2018, 09:28:04 pm »
Have you tried setting the Projection and Distance as shown in Dutchman's booklet for a 12° angle and a 220mm diameter grinding wheel? That should put you on target.

Ken

Offline wootz

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Re: Guided honing on the leather wheel?
« Reply #8 on: July 06, 2018, 01:18:23 am »
Presentation or your kitchen knife, it is honing & deburring that makes your edge either dull or sharp.
Apexing the edge on the grinding wheel is not as challenging as is the honing simply because in honing we apply macro-forces to the tiny edge of 0.2-0.1 micron, and accuracy becomes really critical. Having an angle-controlling device helps not to round that tiny edge.

As to the Herman's platform, I may sound a heretic here but it is usable only if you consciously sacrifice sharpness to the speed of sharpening. The wheel drags the blade forward, resulting in uneven bevel in grinding and play around the edge apex in honing.

.