Author Topic: damaged SJ-200 Tormek Japanese Waterstone  (Read 1843 times)

Offline Global2000

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damaged SJ-200 Tormek Japanese Waterstone
« on: August 15, 2018, 11:25:44 am »
I found on internet new but damaged SJ-200 Tormek Japanese Waterstone at bargain price for 120$.
I was wondering if i will be able to repair it using TT-50 Turning Toll, and how much stone it will reduce to make cleare surface?
Thanks for all responses.

Offline Ken S

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Re: damaged SJ-200 Tormek Japanese Waterstone
« Reply #1 on: August 15, 2018, 12:51:34 pm »
Welcome to the forum, Global 2000.

If the only damage is the chip in the photo along the circumference of the grinding wheel, I would try just use the wheel as is. For carving tools, the edge chip might not be a problem. If that doesn't work well, you can grind away enough of the stone to eliminate the chip. I would recommend very light passes, perhaps less than one number with the microadjust. Keep in mind that a 200mm diameter grinding wheel is considered fully worn at around 150mm. That means that removing 25mm from the radius of your wheel is all that you have.

Your photos do not show the side of the wheel with the inset and the metal Tormek label. If the inset and metal Tormek label are not on the grinding wheel, I would doubt that it is a genuine Tormek product. With the generally overinflated going prices for chipped Tormek wheels, the $120 is either a very good price, a wheel with more damage, or not a Tormek wheel. With the low resolution photos and no text description of the damage, this seems risky. A new, undamaged SJ-200 with warranty should presently sell for $259US.

The other factor to consider is what are you sharpening? Carving tools are a good candidate for the SJ-200. For kitchen knives and general sharpening, the regular SG-200 is quite adequate.

I assume that you are aware that the 200mm grinding wheels are designed for the T4 size machines. They can work on the larger Tormeks, however, the combination is not ideal.

I wish you caution and good luck. Keep us posted.

Ken

Offline RichColvin

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Re: damaged SJ-200 Tormek Japanese Waterstone
« Reply #2 on: August 16, 2018, 09:58:59 am »
My experience on the SuperGrind 2000 is that 185-190 mm is about the minimum usable size.  May be a bit smaller on the T7 or T8, but I’d bet not much. 

Kind regards,
Rich
---------------------------
Rich Colvin
www.SharpeningHandbook.info - a reference guide for sharpening
www.ColvinTools.com

You are born weak & frail, and you die weak & frail.  What you do between those is up to you.

Offline Ken S

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Re: damaged SJ-200 Tormek Japanese Waterstone
« Reply #3 on: August 16, 2018, 12:48:21 pm »
Rich,

The grinding wheel being discussed is the SJ-200. The 200 signifies 200mm diameter, the size of the T4, T3, and T1200 models. The handbook recommends replacing this size when it is worn down to 150mm. (In non metric measurement, this is approximately eight inches worn down to six inches.) The reason for this is that at less that 150mm the grindng wheel sits above the water line in the water trough and the Tormek is no longer a wet grinder.

One could argue that the smaller diameter makes clearance more difficult for tools like longer knives, or that the increased hollow grind becomes problematic. These are real considerations, however, running dry is what stops the Tormek dead in its tracks.

Your experience is correct with the 250mm grinding wheels for the T7 and earlier SuperGrind models. Since the T8 has a raising and lowering mechanism for the water trough, you can use a somewhat smaller grinding wheel. I vaguely recall hearing around 150 mm from support. The reason for this is that being able to raise the water trough and water level allows the grinding wheel to stay in the water when worn down longer.

I think it makes sense to replace either size grinding wheel while some useful life remains. As the wheel diameter decreases, so the advantages of the large Tormek grinding wheels. I think it is better economy to purchase a new grinding wheel earlier and reserve the worn wheel for heavier grinding. Jobs like reshaping tools (as opposed to sharpening) cause more wesr on the grinding wheel. Why not let the worn, but still useful, grinding wheel do the heavy lifting and reserve the new wheel for regular sharpening?

The other reason, in my opinion, for early replacement is when you switch wheels, for example going from the regular SG to an SB. While the SB might be your first choice for HSS turning tools, a worn but still useful SG might be your first choice for carving tools. Replacing your original wheel while there is some useful life in it leaves you options.

Ken

Offline Global2000

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Re: damaged SJ-200 Tormek Japanese Waterstone
« Reply #4 on: August 17, 2018, 10:07:46 am »
Thanks for the welcoming and for the detailed and informative answer.

Stone has got Tormek metal logo on the side. Seller send to me later more pictures where is visible.
I don't have Tormek yet. I am just preparing to buy one and everything show that I will go with T-8 model.
I was looking for some savings with T4 but I see that is not worth it overall in my case.
I am going to use Tormek mostly for sharpening kitchen knifes, some of them are hard metal, sushi knifes etc, which going to benefit with sharpening on Japanese stone with 4000 grit.
I was thinking about buying this damaged SJ-200 for T-8 to have cheaper alternative to try a see effects of Japanese stone, and eventually buy afterwards SJ-250, but i think i will pass this idea.

Regards,
Global2000

Offline Ken S

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Re: damaged SJ-200 Tormek Japanese Waterstone
« Reply #5 on: August 17, 2018, 01:22:34 pm »
Global2000,

You are making good progress. You are evolving from the uninformed beginner to a more informed beginner. That is an important advance. I know that step well. I have been working with my grandson with his 3D printer.  At first, I didn't even know what questions to ask. After a long struggle (longer than the learning curve with the Tormek), I can ask more intelligent questions and do some basic 3D operations. Your developing Tormek questions will serve you well.

My initial decision to purchase a Tormek in 2009 was less complicated than today. Back then, the Tormek (new) was the T7 in the US. The grinding wheel was the SG-250. The smaller T1200 model was marketed primarily in countries with 50hz power. I was fortunate enough to have a very good coach.

Today you must choose between sizes (T4 or T8) and several different grinding wheels. Your decision is further complicated by the new diamond wheel technology. You will also get differing opinions on this forum. Here are my thoughts:

Investing in a Tormek is a longterm decision. The Tormek is designed and built to be a lifelong tool. Between the T4 and the T8, there is no bad choice. One may fit your individual needs more closely than the other, but either will do the job for you. Forget any price difference marketing. Comparably equipped, the difference is small. Ignore the outdated motor duty marketing hype. The overheating issue with the T3 was corrected with the zinc top of the T4. Both models are heavy duty. I use and like both. At my age, if I have to carry a Tormek, the T4, at half the weight, is my first choice. In a large, fixed location shop, you might prefer the larger Tormek. If you like large, super charged cars, you will prefer the T8. If you like to sharpen things, either is a good choice.

I strongly feel a beginner is better served with a new Tormek with its iron clad seven year warranty. Leave used Tormeks to the time when you have become an old Tormek hand and may want or need a second machine to handle your work volume. Also, stay away from older jigs. They still work, however, Tormek is continually improving its products. Some of the new jigs are so improved that I have even recommended longtime users with the older designs switch over.

I would purchase only the SG wheel which comes with every new Tormek. For many years this stalwart has served Tormek users, most of those years as the only choice. Master the SG and the leather honing wheel before even thinking about other wheels. At that time, you can base any decisions on your own skill and actual needs.

I have used 200mm wheels on my T8. The combination works, but not well. Do not factor in the availability of an SB grinding wheel. In my opinion, the new diamond wheels have made the SB obsolete. I would not put much decision weight on side grinding. While it is a nice feature, I believe most of us will continue to be edge grinders.

I would urge you to keep asking questions. You will get several opinions here, different, but all honest. We have no prima donnas on this forum, just fellow Tormekers who want to share the benefit og their experience.

Ken