Author Topic: problem with grinding secodary facets  (Read 2571 times)

Offline Art3

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problem with grinding secodary facets
« on: August 27, 2018, 12:29:38 pm »
When I start the secondary facet process I drop the table down to horizontal, screw the secondary stop up the shaft until it touching the lower face of the primary stop. THen I raise the angle of the table to try and get the heal of the drill to touch the stone and this is where it all goes wrong. The bit of the drill that seems to touch the stone is the edge of the primary facet that I have just ground. So if I grind at this setting I will be cutting into the primary facet! Where am I going wrong, or maybe what step am I missing. I have watch two different vieos and as far as I can tell I am doing exactly what they do.

Offline RichColvin

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Re: problem with grinding secodary facets
« Reply #1 on: August 28, 2018, 03:30:24 am »
Art,

For the secondary facet, are you moving the drill holder to the second stop (see also, page 5, lower right picture in the DBS-22 instructions) ?  If not, it will do exactly as you described.

Rich
« Last Edit: August 28, 2018, 03:32:10 am by RichColvin »
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Rich Colvin
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www.ColvinTools.com

You are born weak & frail, and you die weak & frail.  What you do between those is up to you.

Offline Art3

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Re: problem with grinding secodary facets
« Reply #2 on: August 28, 2018, 12:56:34 pm »
Yes I am using the lower stop see photo and also photo of what is happening. the second pic shows the start of the attempt to grind the secondary facets and how it is actualy cutting into the primary.

Offline RichColvin

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Re: problem with grinding secodary facets
« Reply #3 on: August 28, 2018, 03:20:37 pm »
Art,

Thanks for the pics.  That really helps.  I see a different problem that may fix the one you're experiencing.  The drill bit is not aligned properly in the drill holder.  It needs to be rotated about 45 degrees anti-clockwise.  Below is a picture showing proper alignment.  It's a little more clear than the user manual.



There are also some good videos showing the use of the DBS-22.  I've cataloged 3 on my Sharpening Handbook (www.SharpeningHandbook.info) site.

Kind regards,
Rich
« Last Edit: August 28, 2018, 03:31:37 pm by RichColvin »
---------------------------
Rich Colvin
www.SharpeningHandbook.info - a reference guide for sharpening
www.ColvinTools.com

You are born weak & frail, and you die weak & frail.  What you do between those is up to you.

Offline Art3

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Re: problem with grinding secodary facets
« Reply #4 on: August 28, 2018, 10:04:19 pm »
Yes I discovered that. I did line it up using he original chisel point but I think that must have been wrong to start with. It was looking at the section on refinishing existing primary facets and the bit about starting from scratch with a brocken drill to set me on the right track.
I will use the flutes for alignement for the first grind rather than the chisel point.

Offline RichColvin

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Re: problem with grinding secodary facets
« Reply #5 on: August 28, 2018, 10:41:00 pm »
Art,

As a woodworker, you will greatly appreciate the DBS-22 once you have figured it out.  The use of sharp bits makes woodworking so much easier & less frustrating.  This is particularly true for highly figured woods like burls. 

I like the ability to sharpen on the fly before use.  Takes 1-2 mins, and helps tremendously!

Good luck & do let us know how the journey goes !

Kind regards,
Rich
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Rich Colvin
www.SharpeningHandbook.info - a reference guide for sharpening
www.ColvinTools.com

You are born weak & frail, and you die weak & frail.  What you do between those is up to you.

Offline courierdog

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Re: problem with grinding secodary facets
« Reply #6 on: September 27, 2020, 02:44:38 am »
Having gone through this exact same problem.
My initial attempt I thought I got the Primary Facet exactly as per the manual.
SO What to do, I found worked for me was editing the Instruction Manual for a 16 page Illustrated Instruction Manual to an 89 Page expanded Illustrated Instruction Manual.
Then I had to follow the Manual exactly as written.
It was very tedious and very time consuming.
I found that my Primary Facet was not ground perfectly, however with more patience, and slowing down, I was able to get the Primary Facet exactly as described.
Note this involves ensuring the final grinds are aligned with the line on the Drill Bitt Holder.
When I then moved onto the Secondary Facet grind, I noticed it was the heel of the bit that showed the Secondary Facet Grind that began to appear.
As Ken S said, slow down and sneak up on the Secondary Facet. The Secondary Facet seems to happen much faster than the Primary so go very slow, and ensure as you inspect you work to touch up the drill bit alignment as from my experience, gores very fast and the least bit off alignment you will see the facet look very lopsided very easily. this is cured by careful attention to the alignment.
That First Secondary Facet is a real thrill as you see it develop and are able to vary it back and forth with the drill bit alignment, This is where the use of the magnifier really helps. A tiny adjust meant, a single pass and you will see the facet development.
Patience and consitintancy pays off in 4-Facet dividends.
Retired Engineer

Offline courierdog

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Re: problem with grinding secodary facets
« Reply #7 on: October 03, 2020, 05:33:41 am »
I have been spending a lot of time with my new Toy the DBS22. The thing I most appreciate about it is the support from Tormek themselves and all the forum members who are more than happy to share their experiences.
What truly amazes me about the DBS-22 is how long it has been around an I am only finding out about it nearly ten years late.
My poor drill bits are giving me the stink eye I can tell you. I have abused my drill bits something terrible. It is a good thing Dormer new that people like me exist and seem to have built drills that actually last.
Now that I have the DBS-22 I intend to sharpen every drill prior to using it, If I have not already done so. Just sitting down and sharpening a drill bit just to say you have done it does not really prove anything. Sharpen a drill bit for a specific task will bring rewards in the form of consistent chips that virtually fly out of the metal, in a good way, not in a dangerous manner. So far nothing I have drilled since learning how to sharpen my drill bits with a 4-Facet point has never failed to amaze me with the seemingly effortless process it is now to drill a clean hole. Ken S is right on his comment about creating a Setup Checklist. In my case I use a single page complete with the Illustration from the DBS-22 Manual and its descriptive write up, so in a few short pages I have the complete Setup for each step of the process. There is noting worse than missing a step and having to retrace each step to find out where you went of the rails. With the DBS-22 once you have the process firmly in your mind following the Checklist becomes natural and the consistent results are the reward.
Now Getting my old hands to follow the process can at times be a different story. The lie thing about the Tormek is it is a slow turning water cooled grinding wheel. However do not equate slow turning to slow grinding. you will be amazed just how fast the proper stone cuts metal and all without any discolouration or micro-cracks of the drill bit or tool bit being sharpened. With the Tormek you have time to watch the drill bit facet forming and with practice catch any area which may be going of the rails such as not keeping the drill bit aligned with the Drill Bit Clamp which will result in a deformed Facet which can be tidied up quite easily with a little practice.
The DBS-22 is a pleasure to use and gives in return huge returns in the Drill press under pressure.
Thanks for Listening
Retired Engineer

Offline RichColvin

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Re: problem with grinding secodary facets
« Reply #8 on: October 03, 2020, 07:39:23 pm »
Dave,

Would you send me your checklist?  I’d like to add it to the Sharpening Handbook (http://sharpeninghandbook.info/GT-DrillBits-Twist.html).  You can eMail it to me at SharpeningHandbook@gmail.com.

Kind regards,
Rich
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Rich Colvin
www.SharpeningHandbook.info - a reference guide for sharpening
www.ColvinTools.com

You are born weak & frail, and you die weak & frail.  What you do between those is up to you.