Author Topic: Suggestion regarding forum software - heart for noobs  (Read 1513 times)

Offline braincramp

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Suggestion regarding forum software - heart for noobs
« on: August 01, 2019, 03:58:23 pm »
Hi all,

being a Noob it proved difficult for me to understand all the names and designators around Tormek and its addons. So when I have looked up some Jig name for the umpteenth time to understand what the post was about, I thought that a nice glossary would be really helpful. What do you think? I've seen extensions for that on other sites. The general idea is to automatically detect words which have previously been put in the glossary and highlight them in the post. When the reader hovers the pointer over that word, the description is shown as a tooltip. Could also be click-activated to reduce annoying popups. For Tormek jigs this could be a little tooltip containing the picture and a short info about the purpose of the jig.

Might seem irrelevant, a lot of the forum users here seem to be very proficient at getting their tools sharp, knowing all the DBS-22s and RB-180s out there by heart :D Think of all the silent readers though. There may be many, just like myself before I registered, who are wading through tons of stuff they never heard of before and keep wondering whether it will ever make sense to them.

(just added an attachment with an example)
« Last Edit: August 01, 2019, 04:00:10 pm by braincramp »

Offline john.jcb

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Re: Suggestion regarding forum software - heart for noobs
« Reply #1 on: August 01, 2019, 04:14:50 pm »
I like the idea. No idea how much effort it would take to implement on this site. If it were to be done there are not that many things to define.
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Offline Fernando

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Re: Suggestion regarding forum software - heart for noobs
« Reply #2 on: August 01, 2019, 04:57:31 pm »
Hi all,

being a Noob it proved difficult for me to understand all the names and designators around Tormek and its addons. So when I have looked up some Jig name for the umpteenth time to understand what the post was about, I thought that a nice glossary would be really helpful. What do you think? I've seen extensions for that on other sites. The general idea is to automatically detect words which have previously been put in the glossary and highlight them in the post. When the reader hovers the pointer over that word, the description is shown as a tooltip. Could also be click-activated to reduce annoying popups. For Tormek jigs this could be a little tooltip containing the picture and a short info about the purpose of the jig.

Might seem irrelevant, a lot of the forum users here seem to be very proficient at getting their tools sharp, knowing all the DBS-22s and RB-180s out there by heart :D Think of all the silent readers though. There may be many, just like myself before I registered, who are wading through tons of stuff they never heard of before and keep wondering whether it will ever make sense to them.

(just added an attachment with an example)

I totally agree with you, initially when I entered the forum I was the same everyone talked about USB and I had no idea looking for tormek usb and found no results, after a good time I could understand that it was the "US-105 Universal Support"
A glossary would be something really useful for new community users.
« Last Edit: August 01, 2019, 05:04:54 pm by Fernando »

Offline RickKrung

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Re: Suggestion regarding forum software - heart for noobs
« Reply #3 on: August 01, 2019, 06:09:03 pm »
Pretty good idea, if it isn't too hard to implement and something the site owner and moderator agree to and something the moderator could maintain. 

I have complained at times how many users use the acronyms for jigs and accessories rather than saying in words what item they are referring to.  I strive to include descriptive text, at least at first mention and then in the remainder of the post, the acronym.  Someone put together a list of acronyms, but I don't think it is used much, as I cannot recall where it is on the site and while I downloaded it, I don't refer to it.  I've attached it here, but since I don't recall who created it, I cannot give due credit.  It is in PDF format. 

My method of figuring out jig numbers when just the acronym is given has been to do to the Tormek web site, to the "Grinding Jigs" and "Accessories" tabs and hunt for the acronym to find the name. 

Rick
Quality is like buying oats.  If you want nice clean, fresh oats, you must pay a fair price. However, if you can be satisfied with oats that have already been through the horse, that comes at a lower price.

Offline john.jcb

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Re: Suggestion regarding forum software - heart for noobs
« Reply #4 on: August 01, 2019, 06:24:35 pm »
I remember from my early engineering years working for the US Navy that when you use an acronym you must spell it out when first used in the document. While extra work this might help as there are 30 definitions for USB not including the Tormek one. While most can be ruled out by context it is not readily apparent what a Tormek USB is to the uninitiated.
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Offline RickKrung

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Re: Suggestion regarding forum software - heart for noobs
« Reply #5 on: August 01, 2019, 06:46:17 pm »
I remember from my early engineering years working for the US Navy that when you use an acronym you must spell it out when first used in the document. ...snip...

My highest and most developed exposure to this was when working with the Corps of Engineers on the Columbia and Snake River Hydropower System (FCRPS  ;).  They would have acryonym lists in reports that were multiple pages long - but they were always there.  It was pretty much industry wide, however, as a professional fish biologist it felt like I was almost a full time writer (proposals, reports, reviews, emails, etc.).  Habits like that can be hard to break and sometimes not necessarily a good thing. 

Rick
Quality is like buying oats.  If you want nice clean, fresh oats, you must pay a fair price. However, if you can be satisfied with oats that have already been through the horse, that comes at a lower price.

Offline john.jcb

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Re: Suggestion regarding forum software - heart for noobs
« Reply #6 on: August 01, 2019, 06:54:53 pm »
I also remember the odd order of the item and adjectives. For example Patrol Boat, River or PBR.
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Offline RichColvin

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Re: Suggestion regarding forum software - heart for noobs
« Reply #7 on: August 01, 2019, 10:12:09 pm »
This list was started by someone else, but I've ensured it is as complete as I can.  Hope it helps.

https://www.tormek.com/forum/index.php?topic=4030.msg27881#msg27881
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Rich Colvin
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You are born weak & frail, and you die weak & frail.  What you do between those is up to you.

Offline braincramp

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Re: Suggestion regarding forum software - heart for noobs
« Reply #8 on: August 02, 2019, 08:44:21 am »
Just found this:

http://custom.simplemachines.org/mods/index.php?mod=1525

Seems to do exactly what we’d need. Might be worth taking a closer look at.

Offline Ken S

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Re: Suggestion regarding forum software - heart for noobs
« Reply #9 on: August 02, 2019, 12:01:27 pm »
braincamp,

The format of this forum could certainly use some tuning and updating. Many of us, including me, find the photo process frustrating. It is often difficult to see any detail in the photos with the pixel limitation. I believe the Simple Machines template for this forum predates common photo insertion.

I also find the search function challenging.

I have heard rumors that Tormek would like to modernize the forum. There is definitely room for improvement.

I think the idea of a glossary has potential. I would make a few practical suggestions as a bridge until such time as we might have one:
A number of years ago, Tormek requested that we refer to the jigs using the official Tormek designations. Although this might sound tedious, it is a precise use of language and can be useful, especially to our many members whose primary language is not English. "DBS-22" is the same in any language.
Over the years we have had some confusion with how we describe things like bevel angles. I suggest we  all use the Tormek Handbook as our reference source. Related to this, we should keep our handbooks within easy reach of our computers.
We have "catechism" requirements is many areas of life. We must all learn the rules of the road for safe driving. We must all learn the vocabulary for our chosen careers. There is no need for most Tormek sharpeners to learn "tons of information". Someone who sharpens primarily knives really has no need to study how to sharpen drill bits, turning tools, carving tools, or planer blades. He does have a pressing need to study and master those parts of Tormek technique which pertain to knives and general use.

Ken

Offline Twisted Trees

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Re: Suggestion regarding forum software - heart for noobs
« Reply #10 on: August 02, 2019, 06:04:37 pm »
I read this thread wondering when to pipe up, and what to say.

The original post is simple BUT to put tool tips onto a web page is one thing, to add it in real time to a forum quite another.

My suggestions are what I think is the easiest way forward,

First, make the Tormek Part Numbers thread a sticky one so it is always at the top as a reference. 

Second, Anyone who doesn't recognize an acronym should be encouraged to ask on the thread, this will serve 2 purposes first to encourage thread users to be more careful in acronym use and second it will inform new users to look at the reference post at the top of the page.

Offline Ken S

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Re: Suggestion regarding forum software - heart for noobs
« Reply #11 on: August 02, 2019, 07:41:54 pm »
Excellent post, TT. I like your sticky idea. Should we copy/paste the sticky Tormek Parts Numbers topic to all of the sub forums? That would seem quicker to use to me.

I encourage anyone who does not recognize an acronym to ask for clarification in a post. Somewhat related to this, whenever I include one in a post, I try to note(“English idiom meaning........”). I think the use of idioms in different languages spices up our posts.

Ken

Offline Ken S

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Re: Suggestion regarding forum software - heart for noobs
« Reply #12 on: August 03, 2019, 11:36:02 pm »
I have started a new topic related to this. I suggest that we use the new topic to craft a glossary file. I envision the new topic as an intermediate step. We can all submit suggestions.

The next step would be to combine and edit the suggestions down to a rough draft. After comments about the rough draft, we would formulate a "final" version. This version would be stickied. I am no computer expert, however, it seems that we should be able to temporarily make the rough draft sticky, releasing it when we have a honed version.

I suggest that we divide the glossary into logical subdivisions. The intro should include an explanation of how Tormek creates designations. Emphasis should be on jigs and accessories, while briefly mentioning earlier versions.

 Grinding wheels comes to mind as a good first division. This should include leather honing wheels, truing tools, and the stone grader.

Tools for basic woodworking, as the square edge jig has traditionally included with many Tormek models.

Jigs related to knives should be a full subdivision.

Turning tool jigs and accessories.

The same for carving tools.

Misc jigs would include the DBS-22 for drill bits; the planer blade jig; the jig for molding knives; etc.

Subdividing will make it easier for all of us to focus on what we actually use.

I welcome your comments.

Ken (moderator)

ps I have had numerous long posts mysteriously disappear before completion. This is very annoying, especially with my overly long posts. I would not want checking the glossary to delete posts.