Author Topic: US-430 Update  (Read 2951 times)

Offline Ken S

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US-430 Update
« on: August 31, 2019, 11:19:51 pm »
My new US-430 arrived today, shipped by air from Sweden.I really like it. The bar is 430mm long, which includes 50 mm on the side normally not included with the standard 105-US (the bend side).
The two legs extend 50mm longer than either the standard US-105 or the US-400. The extra length of the two legs makes it possible to sharpen cleavers using the standard USM-45 knife jig.

In addition to long knives and cleavers, the US-430 can serve as a very convenient second support bar. (One support bar faces toward the grinding wheel; the other faces toward the leather honing wheel.) Like the shorter support bars, the one leg has Acme threads for the microadjust.

I do not know the price at this point. When I find out, I will post it.

Ken

Oops... My original post listed the length as 1430mm instead of 430mm. I blame my keyboard.  :)
« Last Edit: September 01, 2019, 11:10:41 am by Ken S »

Offline smurfs

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Re: US-430 Update
« Reply #1 on: September 01, 2019, 10:02:21 am »
Thank you for the update Ken.

Please could you also find out when they are expected to become publicly available so I can get my Tormek stockist to order some in.

Thanks, Andrew

Offline Ken S

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Re: US-430 Update
« Reply #2 on: September 01, 2019, 11:14:08 am »
Andrew,
I will check into the projected delivery date. US-430 is the official Tormek designation. Your local Tormek stockist should be able to find out by checking with that designation.

Ken

Offline Sharpco

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Re: US-430 Update
« Reply #3 on: September 01, 2019, 12:43:33 pm »
I need it.

Offline Ken S

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Re: US-430 Update
« Reply #4 on: September 06, 2019, 11:12:03 pm »
I received an excellent question from a member in a PM. Yes, the new US-430 is completely usable as a regular support bar. I think it would be an excellent choice for a second (or first) support bar.

Ken

Offline van

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Re: US-430 Update
« Reply #5 on: September 09, 2019, 12:49:58 pm »
Good morning,
great news Ken S
We hope that as soon as possible it can be commercialized
I look forward to further news.
Greetings.  ;D
Kindly yours

Offline micha

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Re: US-430 Update
« Reply #6 on: October 06, 2019, 03:11:54 am »
The USB-430 is now on the official Tormek website.
https://www.tormek.com/international/en/spare-parts/other-spare-parts-and-upgrades/us-430-universal-support-extended/

May still take some time until the importers actually get hold of it...

Online jeffs55

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Re: US-430 Update
« Reply #7 on: October 06, 2019, 03:25:05 am »
It should be included with the T8 as standard equipment. It can't cost more than a nickel more to make.
You can use less of more but you cannot make more of less.

Offline Ken S

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Re: US-430 Update
« Reply #8 on: October 06, 2019, 01:17:34 pm »
Jeff,

What would happen if Tormek decided to substitute the US-430 for the now standard US-105 support bars now included with the T8? Users who sharpen cleavers and long knives would be delighted.
Users who sharpen chisels, plane blades, turning tools, carving tools, and drill bits would probably order the "optional" smaller size US-105. If that was not an option, some of us would get out our hacksaws and make our own and post about it.

We see the same situation with the Torlock platform jigs. The big platform works fine with large turning scrapers and the Lacer grind skews. The big platform is clumsy (as are the knife jigs) with small knives. As Tormek does not sell a small platform, we make our own. Herman's design using the platform from the scissors jig works very well. Using parts from the T2's knife jig as suggested by CB also works very well, although it is cost prohibitive.

I see the US-430 as a useful accessory for knife sharpeners. It makes jig sharpening possible with cleavers. It is helpful for long knives and could serve as the only support bar for knife sharpeners.
I think most Tormek users would find the standard US-105 a more user friendly choice for general use.

If Tormek could produce these for no more than a nickel, I would also like to order a fifty dollar Tormek car.

Ken

Online jeffs55

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Re: US-430 Update
« Reply #9 on: October 06, 2019, 02:44:45 pm »
I should have said not more than a nickel between the standard USB and the new 430 model. It may be more than a nickel but less than a quarter between the two. I also should have and in fact did realize that it would have put me and everyone else out of business since I do not regularly sharpen cleavers.
You can use less of more but you cannot make more of less.

Offline Ken S

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Re: US-430 Update
« Reply #10 on: October 07, 2019, 01:33:54 am »
Jeff,

I am confused by your production cost numbers. Thousands of US-105 units have been made for many years. Things like using stainless steel and the special square threads add to its cost. Volume production has lowered its cost.
If the US-430 was substituted as the standard issue support bar, among other costs, the packaging for the T8 would have to be replaced dueto the extra size. I think  many Tormek purchasers who do not sharpen knives would incur extra costs for something of no extra value to them.

Regarding your worry that sharpeners with the capability of jig sharpening cleavers will put today's sharpeners out of business, really? In your sharpening business, how many cleavers do you sharpen. How do you presently sharpen them?

Ken

Online jeffs55

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Re: US-430 Update
« Reply #11 on: October 07, 2019, 11:01:22 am »
Poor choice of words strikes again. "Put out of business" was meant as not being able to perform a certain task and I do not have a sharpening business and have only sharpened one or two cleavers ever and those were done free hand. I am sure the 430 would have made things easier. Regarding cost of the 430 which I do not know at this time. I was implying or rather saying that beyond dimension, it is the same thing as the standard USB. Materials and jigs would in my mind be the same. You can make the same bends using the same jigs, same dies, grinders etc. A "nickel" or "quarter" for the extra few inches of material. If the 430 came standard my ability and everyone else ability to sharpen knives or other shorter length tools would not be possible and thus we would be "out of business". As an aside, I just searched Affinity Tools and typed in "Tormek" to search for the price of the US 430 and the are no entries at all for "Tormek". No Tormek products at all, no search results. So, the US 430 should not be substituted for the more useful standard USB.
You can use less of more but you cannot make more of less.

Offline Stickan

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Re: US-430 Update
« Reply #12 on: October 07, 2019, 02:23:03 pm »
Good morning,
I just want to inform about that Affinity tool is no longer the US importer of Tormek products. Tormek has set up a subsidiary, Tormec Inc, to be able to work closer to our customers.
For any questions outside what the Forum can answer, mail info@tormek.com and we will help.

When it comes to the cost of making any product I think that most people don't count things in like man-hours behind the product, new tools being made to be able to make new products. Only adding the cost of material will not show the actual cost.

For the US-430 in specific, the cost will be displayed soon, the item has not landed in the US yet and will not do so for the next 4 weeks. As soon as it is on the market, our resellers will ad it to their listings.

The US-430 is a product that only a few users need, in fact maybe only those who have a sharpening business where a knife/cleaver is the main tools being sharpened. Other tools that will work are larger axes. For the majority of users, the standard support bar is doing what the design of most jigs is meant for.

Sincerely,
Stig

Offline Josu V

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Re: US-430 Update
« Reply #13 on: October 07, 2019, 04:18:30 pm »
I´m in the group of those who the US-430 is a must have.
I use Tormek T-8 only for sharpen knives (and folding knives), cleavers and scissors (less and less due to Twice As Sharp machine).

Between my customers, are a lot of butchers which long knives (more than 20-30cm) and fishmongers with very long cleavers.
But the reality is that only would need the US-430 in a 30% of times. And probably, I have the the type of customers who use more long knives and long cleavers.
For me, this 30% is a big reason to purchase the new US-430 universal support.

I think that the US-105 as standard equipement is acorrect decission.

Regards
Abusus non tollit usum

Offline Ken S

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Re: US-430 Update
« Reply #14 on: October 07, 2019, 08:15:06 pm »
Changing Importers is unusual, but not unheard of. Affinity Tool was not the first US importer for Tormek. The needs of the business can change over time.

Jeff, if you can find a local machine shop who will make an equivalent of the US-430 for you at a lower price than the Tormek version, go for it. A very small production run, like the US-430 is more expensive than a large production run. A "one off" is the most expensive way to manufacture something. I have no idea how large a production Tormek will do of the US-430. The production runs of the US-400 sold out quickly. Frankly, I was pleasantly surprised the Tormek decided to manufacture the US-430.

My first experience with the US-400 was when Wootz posted. He had found one, the last one, for sale in Italy. Wootz lives in Australia. The regular Tormek line should be readily available for a long time. Even the now obsolete jigs and accessories are readily available online. Several years from now, the US-430 may or may not be available. As Stig correctly states, it is designed for a small niche of Tormek users. I was one of the first purchasers of the US-400. Tormek gave me a US-430 because I helped with the design. If Tormek had not given me one, I would be at the head of the line to purchase one.

Ken