Author Topic: sharpening apps question  (Read 873 times)

Offline Ken S

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sharpening apps question
« on: June 10, 2021, 02:33:54 pm »
I have a question about knife sharpening apps. It is not my intention to compare apps or discuss their value. I have watched a number of well done videos about using these apps. These videos all seem to focus on sharpening one knife. I understand that this simplifies the learning process; it is an effective teaching technique.

What I have not seen is a video showing a typical sharpener situation with ten to twenty (or more) knives to sharpen in a morning. In a hypothetical ten knife batch, how many would receive the computer "treatment"? I realize there is no simple stock answer. I am just curious, not critical.

Ken

Offline micha

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Re: sharpening apps question
« Reply #1 on: June 10, 2021, 02:50:42 pm »
Ken,
as with any other method of setting the USB height, I try to group knives with the same angle, then just set the protrusion for each knife on a block.

If there are knives with different angles, repeat above. Knives I do for other people typically get a 15 dps angle, so it's often not a topic.
Thus all the knives are treated correctly, while there's no need to do all the setup steps again and again.
Mike


Offline Ken S

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Re: sharpening apps question
« Reply #2 on: June 10, 2021, 03:26:39 pm »
Mike,
That seems logical.
Ken

Offline cbwx34

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Re: sharpening apps question
« Reply #3 on: June 10, 2021, 04:42:00 pm »
I have a question about knife sharpening apps. It is not my intention to compare apps or discuss their value. I have watched a number of well done videos about using these apps. These videos all seem to focus on sharpening one knife. I understand that this simplifies the learning process; it is an effective teaching technique.

What I have not seen is a video showing a typical sharpener situation with ten to twenty (or more) knives to sharpen in a morning. In a hypothetical ten knife batch, how many would receive the computer "treatment"? I realize there is no simple stock answer. I am just curious, not critical.

Ken

I only use the app for the sharpening setup... everything else I do (deburring) is freehand.  I don't see it any different than having to adjust the projection distance to maintain the angle, or using any other way.

I think once a person gets used to it, it's just as quick as any other method, except maybe SteveB... since he does everything freehand for the most part.

p.s.  I think Brian (who created the Ultimate Angle Tool) does every knife with it?... (and if I'm not mistaken sets up at gun shows, etc. to sharpen).
« Last Edit: June 10, 2021, 04:44:46 pm by cbwx34 »
Knife Sharpening Angle Calculators:
Calcapp Calculator-works on any platform
or, a couple of iOS Calculators

Offline Ken S

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Re: sharpening apps question
« Reply #4 on: June 10, 2021, 06:12:46 pm »
CB,

I understand what you are saying and, for the record, I have found your Calcapp the easiest program to use.
However, my question was, with ten typical knives to sharpen, how many of them might you use separate Calcapp set ups to sharpen?

Ken

Offline john.jcb

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Re: sharpening apps question
« Reply #5 on: June 10, 2021, 07:00:35 pm »
When I do batches of knives for a customer they are almost always done at the same angle for sharpening and deburring. I look for a projection length using the jig that will work for the set. This way I set the front and back USB height once. BTW I use 2 USB's. When I change knives I clamp it then set the predetermined projection length by using the black knob on the jig. This method works extremely well especially for repeat sharpenings without damage where there is a minimum amount of grinding required.. I have found that a majority of my customers are more knife care conscious when they know that it is easy to be cut. 
Sharpen the knife blade
Hone edge until perfection
Cut with joy and ease

Offline jvh

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Re: sharpening apps question
« Reply #6 on: June 10, 2021, 07:19:18 pm »
I have a question about knife sharpening apps. It is not my intention to compare apps or discuss their value. I have watched a number of well done videos about using these apps. These videos all seem to focus on sharpening one knife. I understand that this simplifies the learning process; it is an effective teaching technique.

What I have not seen is a video showing a typical sharpener situation with ten to twenty (or more) knives to sharpen in a morning. In a hypothetical ten knife batch, how many would receive the computer "treatment"? I realize there is no simple stock answer. I am just curious, not critical.

Ken

Hello Ken,

as I know, there is no such app except TormekCalc2 / BatchCalc module. Sharpening of up to 6 knives / tools in one go is supported at current version, but that can be easily increased. The main reason why there are only 6 positions is that you need the same amount of jigs for batch grinding.

Another unique feature of this module is that the height difference between the individual steps is converted to the required turns of the Tormek Micro adjust nut. I can say, from my own experience, that this method of setting up is fast and very, very accurate.

Unfortunately, the BatchCalc module is not freely available for several reasons, the main one is that the implementation of such functionality is not trivial at all and there is a lot of work and know-how behind it.

Video how it works is here: https://youtu.be/9qtyTKqQb1g

jvh

Offline cbwx34

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Re: sharpening apps question
« Reply #7 on: June 10, 2021, 08:04:54 pm »
CB,

I understand what you are saying and, for the record, I have found your Calcapp the easiest program to use.


Thanks   ;)

However, my question was, with ten typical knives to sharpen, how many of them might you use separate Calcapp set ups to sharpen?

Ken

I use a calculator on pretty much every knife I sharpen.
Knife Sharpening Angle Calculators:
Calcapp Calculator-works on any platform
or, a couple of iOS Calculators

Offline tgbto

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Re: sharpening apps question
« Reply #8 on: June 11, 2021, 08:12:14 am »
I did about ten knives last weekend. I went with a projection length of 145, which when eyeballed would work with all knives (they were medium to large knives, and the short one I did with the triangle pivot jig). I have two Usbs, one on the FVB and the other vertically mounted. I did all of them on the SG, then deburred on the leather wheel with tormek compound, and leather wheel with Chromox. Two knives at a time as I have only two SVM 45s, for the last two which were the nicest ones I switched to SJ before deburring.

All done with the brilliant TormekCalc and calipers, plus a measuring block from schleifjunkies. Maybe not even two minutes total typing on the computer as the different heights for the wheels appear simultaneously. I ordered the All-in-one angle tool but find it a bit too fiddly for my taste.

Cheers,

Nick.

Offline BigJohn

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Re: sharpening apps question
« Reply #9 on: September 23, 2021, 03:37:20 pm »
I have a question that I think fits this discussion. When doing multiple knives of the same, once I put the knife in the jig do i need to complete it from start to polish? Or can i rough grind them all then  fine grind them all and so on? I recently picked up some restaurants and I feel like Switching my stone from rough to fine grind on each blade builds up a lot of slurry and uses up the stones faster. Just courious if my thinking is right or am I way off?

Offline john.jcb

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Re: sharpening apps question
« Reply #10 on: September 23, 2021, 07:12:05 pm »
I have a question that I think fits this discussion. When doing multiple knives of the same, once I put the knife in the jig do i need to complete it from start to polish? Or can i rough grind them all then  fine grind them all and so on? I recently picked up some restaurants and I feel like Switching my stone from rough to fine grind on each blade builds up a lot of slurry and uses up the stones faster. Just curious if my thinking is right or am I way off?

When I do knives that I have sharpened before I first inspect them for damage and then sharpen. Using the SG-250 I find that it settles into a middle ground somewhere between coarse and fine. This is what I use for previously sharpened knives. After a knife is sharpened I grade the stone fine and finish it then hone on the leather wheel. Taking the knife out of the jig is too time consuming.
Sharpen the knife blade
Hone edge until perfection
Cut with joy and ease

Offline tgbto

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Re: sharpening apps question
« Reply #11 on: September 24, 2021, 02:25:54 pm »
When I sharpen knives with the SG, I found there's a given amount of grading that will last for about one knife before the stone gets back to its kind-of-in-between state. So I grade a bit each time just enough that I will sharpen the next knife, obviously more if the knife is longer thant standard. I have a setup with two diamond stones in the jig so I can grade it coarse or fine without changing tool. I no longer grade with the Tormek grading tool.

Cheers,

Nick.

Offline cbwx34

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Re: sharpening apps question
« Reply #12 on: September 24, 2021, 03:46:09 pm »
I have a question that I think fits this discussion. When doing multiple knives of the same, once I put the knife in the jig do i need to complete it from start to polish? Or can i rough grind them all then  fine grind them all and so on? I recently picked up some restaurants and I feel like Switching my stone from rough to fine grind on each blade builds up a lot of slurry and uses up the stones faster. Just courious if my thinking is right or am I way off?

Here's my .02....

I think there's a misconception that knives "have" to be finished with the stone graded fine.  I don't think it does... you can acheive a level of sharpness that is more than enough, without ever touching the stone grader.

As others have stated, the if the stone isn't graded, it reaches an "in-between" state between coarse and fine.  In my experience, this state is more than enough not only to get knives "sharper than factory new", but to make minor repairs, etc.  (Don't be afraid to use additional pressure for repairs, this is one of the few times that additional pressure makes the stone cut better).

To finish the knife, make one or two very light alternating passes on the stone, then hone on the leather wheel.  The secret to sharpness lies in the final steps.

If you're getting knives with a lot of damage, I'd suggest a belt sander for repairs.  (I'd also suggest that sharpness doesn't matter if a place is treating their knives that way). ;)
Knife Sharpening Angle Calculators:
Calcapp Calculator-works on any platform
or, a couple of iOS Calculators